Aspect screen ratio for Euro 2004 matches

[GP-TT]

Hi guys,



I wasn't sure where to put this topic, so here goes it.



I have a 42" plasma and was looking forward to enjoying the matches this month. Can you please explain to me why have both BBC and ITV chosen such an aspect ratio for broadcasting their matches? :x~:-x~:mad:



Last night the Portugal-Spain match was shown as to what I suspect was a 4:3 with lots of black surrounding it, while on ITV the other day the aspect ratio was equally funny. When the screen was reverting to the commentators though, the picture was changing to a widescreen 16:9 format (or was it standard screen letterboxed?) which not as good as full screen, was better anyway.



In contrast to that, the British Eurosport channel was showing the Greece-Russia game in full frame.



Can anyone explain it to me pls?

[CarlB]

Both the BBC and ITV use 16:9 for their studio work, as they are then using their own cameras, but the matches use the coverage provided by the host nation, which is 4:3.



BBC and ITV are not allowed to use their own cameras for the game footage, as normal with major sporting events. The World Cup was the same, but Germany has stated that the next European Championships will be in 16:9. Only 4 years to wait then, by which time we'll all be wondering why it's not being shown in HiDef.



:D~:-D~:grin:

[Squirrelecto]

Well, during the World Cup, IIRC they couldn't guarantee a 4:3 protected frame, so it's either that or the Portuguese company filming the footage don't have widescreen cameras available.

[mcmullanbrush]

I think the pictures from the matches are supplied by a Portuguese televsion company, whereas the studio pictures are from the BBC/ITV.

[mcmullanbrush]

Ooh, we all came at the same time, except me, I took two minutes longer ;)~;-)~:wink:

[sprainedmind]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/reception/euro2004.shtml

[juboy]

I watched the first two matches whilst on holiday in Morocco and, to a point, you can see why the producers haven't bothered with widescreen transmissions.



I didn't see one single 16:9 screen in any of the pubs, clubs, bars and hotels in the entire town we were staying in - even though they're football mad over there and every screen was showing the various matches.



It was literally like W/S didn't even exist.

[Cessquill]

I can see a Euro 2004 memory on my projector being created to size out the 4:3->16:9->4:3 issues

[GP-TT]

Am I to assume therefore from all those replies and BBC'c comments that British Eurosport had their own cameras in the stadium for the Greece-Russia match, hence the different aspect?

[MyOtherAccount]

Only 4 years to wait then, by which time we'll all be wondering why it's not being shown in HiDef.




You'd be lucky in this country, mate :roll:

[CarlB]

<table border="0" align="center" width="90%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td class="SmallText">Quote:</td></tr><tr><td class="quote">
You'd be lucky in this country, mate




Not if Sky stick to their plans. They have issued a press release saying they are looking at HiDef services for 2006.



More here (in the second half of the press release):



http://www.corporate-ir.net/ireye/ir_site.zhtml?ticker=BSY.U (http://www.corporate-ir.net/ireye/ir_site.zhtml?ticker=BSY.UK&amp;script=415&amp;layout=0&amp;it em_id=580035) K&amp;script=415&amp;layout=0&amp;item_id=580035

[Geezer]

Am I to assume therefore from all those replies and BBC'c comments that British Eurosport had their own cameras in the stadium for the Greece-Russia match, hence the different aspect?




All the matches on Eurosport have been in widescreen. So why cant the bbc and itv do it.

[donjohn]

I think, based on my own observation, (and I'm prepared to be shot down in flames by someone who knows better) that Eurosport are using the same feed as the BBC and ITV but are stretching it to 16:9 for broadcast.



One of the games over the weekend was on Eurosport and either BBC or ITV at the same time and, flicking between the two, the picture was exactly the same albeit it seemed to be streched on Eurosport - you certainly couldn't see any more of the pitch on the left and right hand sides of the screen.



John

[CarlB]

I watched some of the France/Greece highlights on Eurosport last night and it was 4:3.

[mugsy]

Eurosport are broadcasting the games in 4:3 meaning you can set your display to 4:3 to watch it in the correct ratio or use a zoom/smart/stretch setting to make it fill the screen. The latter will make the players short and fat.



BBC/ITV are showing the same 4:3 image but it's centred in the middle of a 16:9 feed. If you set your display to 4:3 mode the 4:3 image squashes up in the middle (like when you watch an anamorphic DVD in 4:3 ie before stretching it). The only way you can watch BBC/ITV is to use the widescreen setting of your dislpay to get a 4:3 image with the black bars either side. If you try to use the zoom setting the players look tall and thin as it's applying the zoom as if it were a 4:3 feed which it's not, it's widescreen but the image is still 4:3!



I hope this covers it ...oooooer, my head hurts now :o~:-o~:eek:

[encaser]

I tried using my analogue aeriel feed (instead of Sky) via svideo vcr and then onto my other ws vcr through to my plasma and get 4:3 to 1.85 which, surprisingly, looks alright and the players don't all look like the women's Russian shot-put squad. In fact, its my prefered option for the Euro matches as it looks ok and saves poncing about with aspects or worrying about screen burn issues. Perhaps I've just noted where the ball is going instead of the playeys too much - that still doesn't sound right. Ok sweety :o~:-o~:eek: :lol:

[savage]

The feed on euro sport has definatly been stretch and the BBC and ITV are using the 4:3 ratio as sent to them by Portugise as pointed out by many others here.



Can some one explain the increadably bad quality (probably the band width given by Sky) ITV feed compared to the BBC :o~:-o~:eek:



Thank god the rest of the England matchs are with the BBC - I think? :D~:-D~:grin:



Sav :)~:-)~:smile:

[Squirrelecto]

Can some one explain the increadably bad quality (probably the band width given by Sky) ITV feed compared to the BBC :o~:-o~:eek:



Thank god the rest of the England matchs are with the BBC - I think? :D~:-D~:grin:


It's awful on ITV isn't it?! Compressed to death!



Ooh and not to mention that horrible backdrop that put behind the 4:3 feed. Just keep it black!

[Hotblack Desiato]

It's awful on ITV isn't it?! Compressed to death!








Glad it's not just NTL last nights game reminded me of the bad old days on Ondigital.



Anyone know why ITV/BBC aren't sharing these simultaneous matches like they used to? That is both carrying a game each night, rather than one network carrying the main game, and bumping the second game to their digital only feeds.

[martintyler]

Thank god the rest of the England matchs are with the BBC - I think? :D~:-D~:grin:




:clap: :clap: No more Bobby 'senile' Robson commentating! :clap: :clap:



1-0 up against the french - 'If we dont conceed a goal we will be ok'

[Cessquill]

Watching from a hotel room's portable last nite. 4:3 and it filled the screen. However, it did look like it was absolutely chucking it down ;)~;-)~:wink:

[encaser]

I liked the 'straight guy' who was in support commentary during the England Croatia game on BBC. I've no idea who he is but the droll comments he made were great. Like when Cole clearly said F off to the ref's decision about the free kick and he said, &quot;Ashley disagrees&quot; and &quot;Another moment of magic&quot; when a player suddenly recovered from rolling around injured when the ball came to him.

Bobby really is jumpers for goal posts now, he aint narf me darlin'.



Did anyone else see that Gasgoine documentary on B3 when he went to China? It was really quite enlightening to his mindset and how the people around him - his kif and kin - aren't the best. That is, except for his ex wife who has given him respite from a troubled life. It was touching in places as to how vulnerable the man is and has suffered with inner demons since childhood. The amazing thing was how he can still be quite the assassin when near the box with the golden touch still there.

If it's repeated I recommend a watch :thumbup:

[Cessquill]

You talking about Mark Lawrenson?

[mcmullanbrush]

You talking about Mark Lawrenson?




Mark Lawrenson described as straight :o~:-o~:eek: :lol:

[Hotblack Desiato]

I thought Joe Royal was with Motty but can't be sure as i switched to the 5Live feed.



The Gazza documentary was well worth a watch and left me feeling worried for the guy.

[encaser]

Well I did use inverted commas ;)~;-)~:wink:

[Cessquill]

I was watching in a pub, so didn't get to hear much of the &quot;hoppo's b images/smiley_icons/censored.gif ks&quot;, but guessed at Mark.

[mcmullanbrush]

I thought Joe Royal was with Motty but can't be sure as i switched to the 5Live feed.



The Gazza documentary was well worth a watch and left me feeling worried for the guy.




I remember now, it was Joe Royle, but dont assume he is being droll, I think he is just thick.

[MyOtherAccount]

<table border="0" align="center" width="90%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td class="SmallText">Hotblack Desiato wrote on Wed, 23 June 2004 13:17</td></tr><tr><td class="quote">
I thought Joe Royal was with Motty but can't be sure as i switched to the 5Live feed.



The Gazza documentary was well worth a watch and left me feeling worried for the guy.




I remember now, it was Joe Royle, but dont assume he is being droll, I think he is just thick.




Hate Joy Royle, I really do. His comments about England didn't seem to match the play at all. Despite going a goal down, we were clearly the better team and were playing solid, good football - and yet all he could keep saying was how unconvincing we were, how we weren't getting into it, and so on. Then we score, and it's like &quot;oh that's been coming for a while now&quot;. http://www.avtalk.co.uk/forum/images/smiley_icons/censored.gifing http://www.avtalk.co.uk/forum/images/smiley_icons/censored.gif. Go back to Everton, or whatever failure of a team you once managed.

[GP-TT]

ok guys help me out here,



I posted a previous message and you kindly pointed out the relevant link to the BBC site explaining about the broadcasting issues with Euro 2004 and some of you actually told me about the reasons which I understood and I was fine with that.



This evening though I went to a BBQ at a friends house, who has a 43&quot; Pioneer and NTL cable like me and the match ( and let's not go into that :(_\) was broadcasted in what I could say was a 16:9 format - picture was covering the full screen, no bar lines and I didn't see distortion. How can this happen :?~:-?~:???: He's not an expert, so he couldn't offer any explanation, told me something about NTL digital but didn't make sense? Any ideas pls?



Greece is playing France tomorrow and I would love to see the Greeks causing a big upset on full screen mode :clap: :thumbup:

[CarlB]

His TV was either distorting or cropping the picture, simple as that. Some TVs have a mode that retains the geometry in the centre of the picture, then stretches the edges so you don't notice the distortion so much. I think it's called 'Just' on my Panny plasma, and I can't remember what it's called on my Sony. The other option is that he was watching in Zoom mode, filling the screen but losing info from the top and bottom of the broadcast. I doubt he was doing that, else you'd probably not see the score.

[Hotblack Desiato]

told me something about NTL digital but didn't make sense? Any ideas pls?








Not sure i use NTL and had the &quot;side bars&quot;.

I wonder what happens though if you set the box to 4:3 mode, then run one of those smart justified modes where only the sides are stretched...might this give you a partially distorted 16:9 image? I'll try during the next match.

[GP-TT]

I think it's called 'Just' on my Panny plasma, and I can't remember what it's called on my Sony.




I don't believe this is the case, since when I press 'Just' on my Panny the picture stretches but only within the boundaries of the black lines.



I thought of Hotblack Desiato's idea last night and I will give it a try - set the picture setting of the PACE box into 4:3 and force the aspect on the Panny.

[Hotblack Desiato]

set the picture setting of the PACE box into 4:3 and force the aspect on the Panny.




Yes exactly that...it's the only way i can figure you're friend would have retained the vertical resolution and not distorted the picture too much.

[GP-TT]

Yes I confirmed that was the case last night. I set the cable box to 4:3 and then Panny forced the picture to cover the whole screen. I have to admit that I lost a bit on PQ, but it wasn't as bad as I was afraid. Moreover I had the pleasure seeing Greece having fun with the French :clap: :clap: :clap: :thumbup: :thumbup: in the full 42&quot; glory...